[quote:post_uid0="Nantuko Joe"]Not technically. Technically, everyone is supposed to stay DEAD, but if Enma wants to, he can revive ppl as he sees fit (he has the power to). Now, this isn't just a "strongest fighter" battle, but also more brains. Let's just say taht for the sake of argument, Akuma was really, really weak (like, Videl-strength weak), but still possessed the Shun Goku Satsu. Because he would be weak physically, but have a good ability, does that mean that he can't use it (since this is, as you said, a "Strongest fighter" battle)? No, it wouldn't be fair for a DBZ character to be excluded because of his abilities. Therefore, we can still use the Lord Enma thing.[/quote]
That is true... but then again, Akuma isn't weak, and assuming that he is isn't going to make him that way. And I wasn't excluding Lord Enma. This IS a DB vs SF battle. It's a fight to see which is better at fighting. Reviving yourselves from the dead wouldn't be a fight that shows who is stronger. And besides, if you continuously died, I think you'd get tired of getting killed eventually.

Quote:

And even if you wanted to be like taht, I still figured out a way to defeat GIll. Gill's spirit is immortal, but his body is not: a corporation makes him new bodies. However, since this is a "Strongest fighter" battle, we can't include the corp. that makes Gill's bodies (since they're only scientists, and not fighters, they'd be excluded). Therefore, that would leave Gill body-less, a wandering spirit. And I don't think Gill can fight using only his spirit, and for obvious reasons: if he COULD fight with his spirit, why would he keep needing bodies to reside in? Why couldnt' he just live as a spirit and be immortal? Because...he can't fight as a spirit. Either way, DBZ still wins

Actually, it is a strongest fighter battle, so yes you can exclude the scientists. But that does not leave him bodiless. At the beginning of the fight, he could just increase the temperature around the DB'Z' fighters and melt them all away. Simple, no? So either way, SF still wins.

wouldn't gill's own body be destroyed along with z fighters if he raised temperatures?

Not if he only increases it around the DB'Z' Fighters.[img:post_uid4]http://www.boomspeed.com/sakura/hehe.gif[/img:post_uid4]

So what if they would get tired of it? It still doesn't change the fact that they CAN be brought back from the dead. And if any of the Saiya-jins get killed and brought back, they would get a HUGE power up for each time they came back.

Roll, are you THAT simpleminded? First off, Gill can't just raise the temperatures in a small space around someone's body. He would have to raise the temperature to over 3 thousand degrees over a large area to affect the Z fighters. Also, the Z fighters would be able to form a shield against the heat until they could fly away from the heated area. And if the SF characters are grappling with the DBZ characters, and Gill raises the heat, the SF characters would also be melted if they're in close proximity with the DBZ characters.

And Buu cannot be defeated by the heat or great temperatures. As we all know, the Ki blasts in DBZ are energy, and energy is moving. The faster the atoms in energy move, the hotter it gets. That is why the blasts in DBZ are hot. Now, if Buu exploding, then being blasted by heat couldn't kill him, raising the heat won't kill him. The only reason Buu was killed was because Goku's Genki Dama had a greater amount of energy than Buu could fend off. The Genki Dama simply had more power than Buu, and thus he was destroyed. However, raising the temperature won't affect Buu.

And for Gill's temperature to break through a shield by the Z fighters, it would have to be raised to a lot above the heat of molten lava. If that were the case, the very oxygen and nitrogen and assorted chemical molecules in the air would ignite, and cause an explosion that would cover a HUGE area of the sky. (it's kind of like a bullet piercing a tank of compressed oxygen).

And finally, if even a weak fighter such as Yamucha kills the scientists and the bodies of Gill, Gill would be left bodiless in the event of his body's destruction.

[quote:post_uid0="Nantuko Joe"]So what if they would get tired of it? It still doesn't change the fact that they CAN be brought back from the dead. And if any of the Saiya-jins get killed and brought back, they would get a HUGE power up for each time they came back.

Roll, are you THAT simpleminded? First off, Gill can't just raise the temperatures in a small space around someone's body. He would have to raise the temperature to over 3 thousand degrees over a large area to affect the Z fighters. Also, the Z fighters would be able to form a shield against the heat until they could fly away from the heated area. And if the SF characters are grappling with the DBZ characters, and Gill raises the heat, the SF characters would also be melted if they're in close proximity with the DBZ characters.

And Buu cannot be defeated by the heat or great temperatures. As we all know, the Ki blasts in DBZ are energy, and energy is moving. The faster the atoms in energy move, the hotter it gets. That is why the blasts in DBZ are hot. Now, if Buu exploding, then being blasted by heat couldn't kill him, raising the heat won't kill him. The only reason Buu was killed was because Goku's Genki Dama had a greater amount of energy than Buu could fend off. The Genki Dama simply had more power than Buu, and thus he was destroyed. However, raising the temperature won't affect Buu.

And for Gill's temperature to break through a shield by the Z fighters, it would have to be raised to a lot above the heat of molten lava. If that were the case, the very oxygen and nitrogen and assorted chemical molecules in the air would ignite, and cause an explosion that would cover a HUGE area of the sky. (it's kind of like a bullet piercing a tank of compressed oxygen).

And finally, if even a weak fighter such as Yamucha kills the scientists and the bodies of Gill, Gill would be left bodiless in the event of his body's destruction.[/quote]
Geez, Nantuko, are you THAT ignorant? Now I see why Tarkan quit. Of course he could raise the temperature around him, and even if he does melt the SF Fighters away, he'd still melt the DB'Z' fighters as well, no matter how high the temperature has to be raised. And while they are grappling with the SF's, if they are able to form a shield around themselves from the heat while grappling, then I guess they're multi-talented, aren't they?

And as for that thing about igniting the very oxygen and nitrogen and "assorted chemical molecules" in the air, is there any proof that that can happen, or did you make that up yourself? Because I have never heard of such a thing being even tried/proven before in all my life, and I read a LOT of books. The only thing I know, is that the hottest magma (that I know of) found is the Basaltic magma which is ESTIMATED (since it cannot be measured) to be between 1000 C and 1200 C. So, if you could, please post where I can find more information on the effects of the increased temperature in the air.

I made it seem like he makes an imaginary wall...? Wow....

The following is http://www.boomspeed.com/sakura/offtopic.gif
I'll be editing my post later with another argument thingy. Right now, My aunt, uncle, and cousin are leaving for New York, and I'm going with them to say goodbye. brb.

I think that the air explosion might be true. I'm pretty sure it happens near the sun. I think that the atoms would collide and split, which is how atomic bombs work(I think...). That split would release an enormous amount of energy, but it still might not work.

Also, Goku was surviving about 10 ft. from a star in the Namek saga, so...

[quote:post_uid0="Gotenks13"]Also, Goku was surviving about 10 ft. from a star in the Namek saga, so...[/quote]
Umm...no?

um.. not really, you're talking about nuclear fusion and 3 thousand degrees isn't NEARLY enought to cause that. and neither oxygen or nitrogen would not ignite, it would need some kind of fuel (e.g. hydrogen, gasoline, oil, etc). oxygen and nitrogen are not flammable in their natural state. the only reason a tank of oxygen or nitrogen would explode is because the gas is EXTREMELY dense and the pressure is IMMENSE and that the slightest puncture would release all that pressure which would create kinetic, then heat energy.

how do i know this? well, lightning is at a temperature far greater than magma and it does not ignite the gases in the atmosphere on fire.

Oxygen is needed to make ignite because its a catalyst speeds up reactions, and Lightning bolts don't ignite in the air because oxygen is not a fuel but a catalyst.

I thought the debate stopped and DBZ had won. I remember seeing it in a post. Oh well!

[quote:post_uid0="princevegetam"]um.. not really, you're talking about nuclear fusion and 3 thousand degrees isn't NEARLY enought to cause that. and neither oxygen or nitrogen would not ignite, it would need some kind of fuel (e.g. hydrogen, gasoline, oil, etc). oxygen and nitrogen are not flammable in their natural state. the only reason a tank of oxygen or nitrogen would explode is because the gas is EXTREMELY dense and the pressure is IMMENSE and that the slightest puncture would release all that pressure which would create kinetic, then heat energy.

how do i know this? well, lightning is at a temperature far greater than magma and it does not ignite the gases in the atmosphere on fire.[/quote]
Ok, we can stop this fcuking oxygen debate. I already admitted I was incorrect last page. We don't need to carry it out any more.

And the debate will continue until Roll stops trying to convince me that Enma can't send the fighters back

[quote:post_uid0="Scorponok"]I only read up to page 8, so I don't know all the stuff you guys said. Just to clear things up(If it hasn't been done so already) I know of 3 SF movies, just to let you ppl who think there's only 1 know. From the one I saw, here are some things they could do..

Ryu & Ken: The Hadouken does alot more than in the game, it takes a few seconds to charge up while lighting bolt looking things surround the person, then when you get hit(this happened to Ken) he flew back, all his clothes were burned out, he got a little burnt I think, and he fell down unconsciousness. The Shoryuken move is alot bigger too, one Shoryuken move on Sagat and he was out of the fight, that's where he got that huge scar on his chest. The spinning kick is deadly too. Ryu's and Ken's hadoukens blew up Bison and his huge plane at the end. Their bodies are pretty strong too, considering Ryu will just jump in front of a semi truck with Bison in it.

Sagat: Not much to be seen of him in the movie. Only special moves was this one thing he did at the beginning of the movie. He gathered some energy in his hands and slammed it on the ground or somethin and made an explosion, blowing Ryu back.

Guile: Only saw Sonic Boom in the movie, he pulls his head back and hands and comes forward saying "Sooniiiiiic BOOM!", it tears a house in half. I don't know if that's anything special since it was made of straw, lol(E. Honda's home).

Vega: not much, but he is FAST.

Bison: This freak can teleport like crazy, other people's attacks just go through him, he can take over some ppl's minds too.

Dhalsim: He can throw balls of fire, can teleport, and in the movie he pinned Honda on the ground with his mind and he couldn't get up.

Ahh, that's about it. SF has some strong characters, but DBZ seems to have alot more, so.. I dunno, Ryu and Goku have one thing in common-they're pigs, when Ryu eats, man, he EATS! lol.....[/quote]
as tarkan said before, any SF movie is unofficial (otherwise it would conflict with what Capcom says). all those characters are NOTHING compared with Oro, Gill and Shin Akuma.

1. that energy move by sagat was his "tiger wave" or something like that

2. vega's speed is #### compared with any dbz character

3. most of those things you said, the characters can do in the game

4. you should play more SF and Vs series games (no offense or anything)

Nantuko Joe, here are the characters that could take DBZ characters and not get killed like a bitch.

Shin Akuma
Shin Bison (SFA3 Final Bison)
Gill
Oro
Ryu 15 years after SFIII: Third Strike

dan, that was only a prediction by oro, we can't confirm the amount of power ryu has, so it can't be used in this arguement.

15 years after SFIII: 3rd Strike, Ryu has a power equal or greater than Oro's.

How about this... if Enma can keep on sending the DBZ fighters back, then the organization can keep making bodies for Gill to be resurrected in. A stalemate, then.

[quote:post_uid0="Dan Hibiki"]15 years after SFIII: 3rd Strike, Ryu has a power equal or greater than Oro's.[/quote]
you don't know that for sure, it was just a prediction by oro, so it's not necessarily true

[quote:post_uid0="Dan Hibiki"]15 years after SFIII: 3rd Strike, Ryu has a power equal or greater than Oro's.

How about this... if Enma can keep on sending the DBZ fighters back, then the organization can keep making bodies for Gill to be resurrected in. A stalemate, then.[/quote]
Not quite. You see, the Z fighters can send someone like Roshi or Chaozu to kill the scientists and destroy the factory where they make the bodies. However, the SF characters can't kill Enma.

So Nyah Nyah!

I have a question. If Buu isn't a "True" living being, then would/could you call him an object?

Oh, and Nantuko, thanks. ^.~

[quote:post_uid0="TarkanX"]If SF, and DB fought(and on ground), who would win?

Post why you think each would win(and don't say dumb things like, "because gOkU cAnZ detrsoZ dA uNIverz"), back up your evidence also.[/quote]
ok dbz will win nufe said bye

I dunno exactly. He's alive (he can think, and act for himself), but he has no internal organs or brain to speak of, because he was created from pure magic. I'm not exactly sure how to classify him

I really don't care much about you spamming the other topics, but YOU DON'T SPAM IN THIS ONE! THIS TOPIC IS SACRED, DAMMIT! NOW DIE! DIE! DIE!

The DBZ fighters can't kill the scientists if they don't know where they are. Also, they don't have high enough Ki to be easily locatable. Thusly, Gill can be infinitely resurrected.

So you can't think of a classification? Hmm...I'll post an idea later.

dbz wouled win because all the martial arts all z fighters the whole dbz series the whole db series even the bad guys and cell could transport the whole sf series to another planet and everybody could give there energeis to goku to make a gigantic spirit bomb and throw it to the planit that cell transported them to httas just my opinion

Veggeto, leave the DB Side to Nantuko and Vegetam, k? They're doing great all alone.

whatever you say roll ill leave them alone ??? ??? ???

actually mystic vegetto does point out a good point. the dbz with teleportation capabilities can just teleport all the SF fighters to another planet, blow up the planet, and leave before it explodes.

... uh, Gill could just incinerate anybody who tried to get to the lab. Roast em' toast em', and all. Goku, King Kai, and the people of Yardrat are the only ones who can teleport using Shunkan Idou, and are thusly the only ones who can get there fast enough. Gill would just incinerate anybody who got close to the lab using his elemental powers.

After killing the intruder, Gill could use his power to lower the temperature AROUND the lab to Absolute Zero, where there are no possible reactions. The zone would negate any energy attacks thrown by DBZ fighters, and would insta-kill anybody who tried to cross the zone. NOTHING can function, much less live, at Absolute Zero.

show me some proof that gill can control elements in his soul form.


gill cannot raise the temperature instataneously to such a high level (show me some proof he can). it'll take him some time to raise the temperature and by then someone would've teleported the guy to the underworld already.

Using temperature based attacks is only his special move in the game. That should be proof enough.

Now... can Buu be considered an object or not?

Dude, Absolute Zero is 0*C, and 0*F. It's not that cold. During the winter in the mid-west states, the temperature can hit 15* below Zero, and they can still live. When I worked in Frozen Foods at Shop Rite, the Ice Cream freezer was at -40*F, and I got locked in there for an HOUR and was fine.

And there's no proof that "absolute zero" would negate the DBZ fighters attacks. And how do you know Gill can still use his powers devoid of a body? A spirit w/o a body is a ghost, and ghosts can't hurt ppl, they just wander the earth. Therefore, if someone got there before Gill, then destroyed the factory AND his awaiting body, he'd be fcuked out of a body, and effectively removed from the fight

Buu is not alive in the terms we use (ie, he doesn't breathe, he has no internal organs or brain to speak of, just putty. He's an abnormality, an enigma. There is no way of classifying him

Point is that he can still lower the temperature, Nantuko.