Eminem's encore album leaked... - Yessir....

[Battleaxe22]

For those of you who wish to get the leaked version of

Eminem's album entitled "Encore" due out November 16th,

2004, hit this site up and follow the instructions. Opinions

pertaining to the album have been varried. Leave your

reviews and comments here.

Eminem-Encore.net

*Information obtained from HH411 of Gunitworld.com*

-Chris

[imported_Makaveli]

just copped it, to what i heard so far its okay, im not really a fan of eminen and that just lose it song is frickin annoying.

[Battleaxe22]

I deffinitly agree wtih you on that. I would have to say if you

are going to appreciate this album you have think of Eminem

as a child and that most of his stuff is humerous. If you think

of Em that way-- and not his demonic alter-ego-- than you

may enjoy the album

-Chris

[Battleaxe22]

I can't believe no one from this forum wanted to check this

album out. I am very surprised.

-Chris

[marvel911]

Again? Jeez his previous album was leaked too...Oh well, I read in the paper that the release date was moved to an earlier date.

[Battleaxe22]

Again? Jeez his previous album was leaked too...Oh well, I read in the paper that the release date was moved to an earlier date.
You are correct. November 12th is when the album will be

dropping, now.

-Chris



Edited By Battleaxe22 on 1099722014

[imported_Makaveli]

ha, i had predicted this he will be madd pissed off no doubt.

[Battleaxe22]

[quote:post_uid0="Makaveli

[pip99]

[quote:post_uid0="Makaveli

[blaze985]

I don't have much respect for someone who disses their own mother. I don't care what happened; it's distasteful and wrong. Without her, he wouldn't exist. Now, for my own sake, I wouldn't mind very much if he didn't exist. One less wannabe to worry about...

[QUIET_KILLER]

:stupid: hmm... blaze ta might have a point :biggrin:

[_dmx_]

^ he earned street credit..

[Battleaxe22]

Wow, did any of you notice pip has over 6000 posts? I'm at a

loss for words.

And you two are both correct, Blaze is by far the most

insightful person in this community, with the exception of

maybe Nantuko, where ever the hell he may be.

-Chris



Edited By Battleaxe22 on 1099840461

[imported_Makaveli]

^ he earned street credit..
yeah im going to have to agree with you he did and he's been doing his "thang" *if we like it or not* for a while now. Hes holding his own and can you really call him a wanna-be if he is achually doin' it?

[blaze985]

Yes, I believe you can. To be honest, I hate rap music. I find it all to be the same. but, I have some respect for Tupac. In fact, I would go so far as to say that I could even show some respect for a few other rappers. but, Eminem does nothing but diss others. His put-downs are getting weaker and weaker by the minute. I've seen wine-coolers that are stronger. He's a half-sane moron who's on the verge of lunacy. At least Tupac spoke about real-to-life things in his songs. You can't say that for Eminem because he's too busy dissing everyone left and right. Eminem will always be just another wannabe, but Tupac and those like him will have their memory to live on forever.

[imported_Makaveli]

^^ Half-sane or not he still has his own record company (Shady Records)and has made millions, 3 multi-platinum albums and the shady empire is still growing with that new shade45 channel. ill at least give him some cred for that.

[blaze985]

If riches define who you are, than this world is completely full of pathetic ingrates. Tell me. Does Bill Gates deserve respect when he is a ruthless business man who cares nothing for the small person? Does that Communist Dictator full of wealth and power deserve any respect when he kills his generals for no reason other than his own paranoia (Stalin)? Hmm? The answer is, unequivically, no. It is moronic to say that those 'accomplishments' give Eminem anything more than money and fame. I believe it to be common sense that money and fame don't deserve respect. To be frank, this sounds weird coming from myself, being a wealthy Texan (as VF pointed out), yet it is the truth. Rich people, famous people, and others like them deserve no more respect than the simple garbage man making a living. If you ask me, that garbage man deserves more, for he's busy doing that which most find degrading to simply put food on the table. The same goes for the janitor, the teacher, and the other jobs that most overlook simply because they get paid crap and no one wants to do it.

[KenDaShoto]

U no i never thought a rich person would ever admit to that
blaze985 i tip my hat to you

[Jerry19]

No offense, by why are you people pointing out all the reasons why not to like Eminem in a topic about Eminem's new album being leaked? It's pointless and doesn't really relate to the topic. Anyways...I'm sorta "excited" about the new album that'll be coming out soon. I'm sure there will be plenty of entertaining songs to listen to. Question...Is the song "Just Lose it" gonna be included in it?

[blaze985]

Well, Jerry, Battleaxe said to leave your comments. We're commenting on Eminem, and that very much relates to the topic. It is, after all, Eminem's CD. :unclesam:

[Virtual Fighter]

[color=#F87500]
I don't have much respect for someone who disses their own mother. I don't care what happened; it's distasteful and wrong. Without her, he wouldn't exist. Now, for my own sake, I wouldn't mind very much if he didn't exist. One less wannabe to worry about...


Emenem

[DaSuperTrooper]

Yup Dangermouse's grey album does own, the beat on encore is truely great..

back on topic.

I am too looking forward to his album.. prob get it form irc in the end.. always a couple of kiddy, humourous songs which is great , then you get the real eminem songs, such as sing for the moment.. he is a musical genius, as is michael jackson.

good day. :music: :music:

[Battleaxe22]

I was going to post something along the lines of what Vf

posted, however he got to everything before I ever had the

opportunity. I'm a little disappointed, I like debating,

especially in topics I am fairly current with. Blaze, keep the

debate going!

-Chris

[Virtual Fighter]

Yup Dangermouse's grey album does own, the beat on encore is truely great..

it's actually Savoy Tuffle, from the beatle's white album.

REALLY good song, i'm really really happy how dangermouse intercorperated it into the song.

BTW: just to clarify, blaze is anti-eminem, anti-mainstream rap, pro-tupac.

i am pro rap, pro eminem, pro-tupac. (even though he was all gagnsta gangsta at the top of the list)

[imported_Makaveli]

If riches define who you are, than this world is completely full of pathetic ingrates. Tell me. Does Bill Gates deserve respect when he is a ruthless business man who cares nothing for the small person? Does that Communist Dictator full of wealth and power deserve any respect when he kills his generals for no reason other than his own paranoia (Stalin)? Hmm? The answer is, unequivically, no. It is moronic to say that those 'accomplishments' give Eminem anything more than money and fame. I believe it to be common sense that money and fame don't deserve respect. To be frank, this sounds weird coming from myself, being a wealthy Texan (as VF pointed out), yet it is the truth. Rich people, famous people, and others like them deserve no more respect than the simple garbage man making a living. If you ask me, that garbage man deserves more, for he's busy doing that which most find degrading to simply put food on the table. The same goes for the janitor, the teacher, and the other jobs that most overlook simply because they get paid crap and no one wants to do it.
i give him credit not because of his money, but the fact that he was able too get into the position he could, not everybody can own and produce your own record empire, the "garbage man" you talked about does his job not because he likes it, but because he has to, he hasnt got himself into the position to be a successful businessmen. look its easy to get a standard job picking up garbage* dont get me wrong im not saying the job's easy im saying its easy to get a job like that* but try become the owner of your own record company and sell millions of records, how easy you think that is? for any average joe that would be nearly impossible, for somebody coming from a run down neighberhood c--*spelling* where oppertunity comes around alot less often then i think that is a great achievement in itself...so...that is why i give Eminem respect and credit because he damn well earned it.

[blaze985]

First of all, VF, I'll deal with the Bill Gates issue first, considering I know much more about him than I do rap artists. It has been proven due to sources the news stations have documented that Gates donates money to many different causes, but he does this for two reasons. Number one, he's in trouble for a monopoly. He has to win favor in many people's eyes, and he does this by donating money to various causes. Secondly, he gets tons of tax right-offs for donating money, and this is his second reason for doing it.

Furthermore, I don't really give a poop what Tupac raps about. If I must, I'll get information on him from Masta since Masta is his biggest fan or whatever. Secondly, I'm not exactly pro-Tupac. I'm pro-Tupac is better than Eminem. In addition to that, I got Eminem's The Eminem Show Album, and I remember a line in one of his songs. It's something to the effect of kids wondering if he raps what he does. Later on in the CD (or maybe before, it doesn't really matter), he talks about shooting people and such because he's some sort of soldier. Yes, well, something tells me you won't blatantly admit to criminal acts you've really commited due to this thing we call a law. Oh yeah, and to add to the list of what Eminem tends to diss. I remember that song White America. Now, based on the title alone, it's all about being racist. Oh, does poor Eminem feel sorry for himself because people don't think white people can rap? Too bad. Oh, and then you can move on to the lyrics of the song. After I listened to it the first time, I had to honestly listen to it a second time just to make sure I heard it right. I don't care what anyone says or seems to think they know, that song is completely and utterly anti-America. People like him make me wish this was a Communist Dictator simply so he'd get executed. And, as I said earlier: I don't care what she's done, you don't disrespect your mom like that. Moreover, Eminem doesn't really run his own company. It's been compared before, and I believe it to be accurate. Eminem runs his company like Schwarzenegger (however the Hell his name is spelt) runs California. He has people do it for him; he's the figure head. To be completely honest, Eminem is not that smart. I know for a fact that VF, Chris, The Shiz, Warmor, and I are all smarter than he is. So, his 'company' doesn't really amount to much other than the fact that he's a good figure head. but, then again, so is Tony the Tiger. He runs his business very well, doesn't he? :sarcasm: I know that someone is going to come along and try to prove that Eminem is some genius or whatever, but he really isn't.

Now to move on to the whole comparison to rock music. First of all, rock music is completely different from rap music, and the two are impossible to compare. I'm a lead guitarist in a band that plays at one of he local *insert whatever word you want to use that is defined by a place where you hang out*, and the two styles of music are so different, they're almost on two completely different sides of the spectrum. Anyways, I'm way too tired to continue this long post anymore.

[imported_Makaveli]

*side note* ya heard? 2-pac got a new CD coming out and its produced by Eminem, the 2 singles i got that will be on it are SICK as hell, this CD gon' be straight FiYa

[Battleaxe22]

Number one, he's in trouble for a monopoly. He has to win favor in many people's eyes, and he does this by donating money to various causes. Secondly, he gets tons of tax right-offs for donating money, and this is his second reason for doing it.

A man of bill gates stature-- consequently the depths of his pockets-- should feel more inclined to donate some of his wealth towards worthy causes (ex. Cancer research, cure for aids, un-sheltered children) and not soley because he has run into some extensive criminal road blocks. The tax right off aspect of the situation is another issue altogether, one which can vary pertaining to responses. Thus, I will have to agree with Blaze on the Bill Gates Issue.

I'm pro-Tupac is better than Eminem.
That's a judgement call. You are entitled to your opinion, as allocated by the law, however, ones man's trash is another man's treasure. Suburban white kids look up to Eminem how the Hood-wreck children of the west coast Ghetto looked up to Tupac. If you are to analyze Pac's lyrics, you will realize that he degrades women to an extent that Em has yet to reach. Not to mention, he was one of the first Emcee's to be critique'd on his homophobic material. I say different face, same game.

I remember that song White America. Now, based on the title alone, it's all about being racist.
I will be one of the first to admit that racism has taken a violent swing of direction, and has recently--as of the last ten years-- been directed towards "White America." Just from conversing with the likes of Pip and Makaveli, I know that racism is a non issue in their respective countries. However--speaking solely from a French Canadian Perspective-- the black and white Races are truely segregated here. I am fortunate enough to have friends in the black community, however, it is hardpressed to do so, for the ethnic minorities hold a strong grudge against the white community. The rest of the world has lost a substancial amount of respect for "white Americans" since the War on Iraq commenced. And for many, they feel persecuted for a decision they had little to nothing to do with. Why human kind resists to come to together as one in unity, confounds me to this day. but, the point remains, racism exists on every level. This is not a great time to be a White American. I assure you.

Now, I am one of the biggest supporters of Tupac, but I am willing to admit that he advocated violence-- in general-- as much as any lyrics expressed by the Shady/Aftermath/G-unit Crew. These two individuals are very much the same but have risen from different grass roots. They preach to his own and garner respect from all. If you happened to watch Tupac's recently released documentary entitled "Ressurection" Tupac reveals that a large quantity of his fan base is the White Community, and he is gratefull, for their interest in his cause is what puts food on the table for his existing children, today. The same can be said for Em; a large majority of his fans are ethnic minorities. Therefore, you have to put things into perspective and realize that these two individuals are similar in more ways than you can imagine. Em has ceased his excessive drug use and subsequently terminated demonic lyrics pertaining to the rape/murder of his ex-wife-- Kim Mathers. A sign that the angry white boy has commenced his movement towards maturity. He encountered a moment of clarity, or an epiphany. His daughter deserves all the love and attention he can afford to give her at this stage in her life, for a child cannot bear to see their father in jail. Give the man a chance.

-Chris



Edited By Battleaxe22 on 1099921627

[raddaman0628]

I'm listening to the first (not counting the curtains up part) 2 songs and they explain many things of his life. Its like the songs know what Chris and VF are saying. I think I am crazy or something cause I actually understand most of what the songs say the first time. Listen to it first.

I like Eminem cause he doesn't normally repeat the same words 10 times over probably no more than 6. He actaully talks for more than 2/4 of the song without repeating the same words on what the song is about. An example just loose it: that song sometimes hets annoing but he only repeats the Now I'm gonna make you dance more than 5 times. They are sometimes funny, kind of sad, and just plain stupid (the good way as in say out many words and make up a song).



Edited By raddaman0628 on 1099932674

[Virtual Fighter]

[color=#F87500]Furthermore, I don't really give a poop what Tupac raps about.
well, if you love and respect him so much, shouldn

[KenDaShoto]

this topic has gone on about what Eminem has and hasnt can and cant do has done right and done wrong blaze985 said he isnt smart not by genius standards no but where he fits in hes f***n einstein yea he tlks about his mom did u hear anything vf said? and about white america did u care to stop listenin at the end when he says hes just playin and if anyone has anything else they can point out about how eminem sucks or has done wrong show me ur perfect and ill willing accept everything u say as fact

[blaze985]

VF, I got about halfway through your post and realized something. You didn't pay attention. For instance, you took me talking about the White America song by its title. If you would've paid attention, you would've realized I went into the actual lyrics of the song, as well. Therefore, I didn't judge the song by its cover. I clearly listened to the song. In addition, you repeatedly accused me of only listening to the songs once. I stated very clearly that I listened to that song again just to make sure I got the meaning. Moreover, you discussed the comment I made about him talking about shooting people. I was using what he said in that song to justify my reasoning that in the song where he comments on people asking if he raps what he does, he clearly doesn't. Therefore, he's just 'rapping' about stuff he doesn't even do. I wouldn't go as far as to say he doesn't know about it, for I realize he lived in a bad place. Yet, experience does, indeed, give you a new understanding of what the topic being discussed is all about. To be honest, anyone who raps about killing people is off their rocker unless they actually have killed someone. The same goes for shooting people. Killing/shooting people is not something to take lightly. Oh yes, you mentioned how I said that I don't care what Tupac rapped about. Well, it's true. I should probably care about what he raps about if I take the view that he's the best rapper or better than Eminem. Well, I know what Eminem raps about, and I don't like it. In addition, I've listened to Masta praise Tupac enough that I can have a good estimate of what he does rap about. I trust Masta, and I know he doesn't lie to me. If you want to say he's lying to me, that's your business. That song, White America, is anti-America. He even had to put that part at the end in there to try to save himself. The censorship that we have is based on what, VF? It's based on a government program. Thus, he's pissed at that program and what caused that program: the American government. You can't love America while hating its government. And, yes, he SHOULD thank her for not killing him. In addition, after all the emotional abuse she's had to accept PUBLICLY, I think it's just fine for her to give him some of his own medicine. To be frank, I have three friends who have single parents - moms. Two of those three people's moms say that they were a mistake and they hate them. Guess what. They don't hate their moms. They love their moms and respect them, and they don't condone Eminem's disposition either. Oh, and don't bring my family into this debate. My dad does run my household because that's what the Bible says. Fathers are to lead the household, and that's exactly what my dad does. My mom gives her opinion, but more often than not, her opinion is overriden. And, since you think that Eminem shouldn't love/respect his mom because she didn't kill him or abort him, I suppose his songs and his company share the same bond. Therefore, his company doesn't need to love, respect Eminem. Nor does it need him. One thing you failed to contend with is stock. You can easily buy out a company, and if someone were to buy out Eminem's company, it would run just the same. In fact, it could run even better, depending on the business man who took it over. Oh, and again... Rap and Rock are totally different. Notes don't define a genre of music. In fact, considering notes are in ALL types of music (yes, that includes Country), they can't be a valid point of reference. You must go into tempo, beat, instruments, and things of that nature. To do a rap song, you need a synthesizer, a rapper, and maybe, just maybe, a set of drums and a keyboard. The funny thing is, the rapper is what makes the rap song. Without the rapper, it'd be a version of techno or R&B. Rock music is totally different. What makes rock... rock... is not the singer. In fact, Metallica has proven time and time again that it does not take a vocalist to make a rock song. The simple emphasis on the two genres is enough to point out why they are impossible to compare. Furthermore, you can't take my statement about Communism to mean I'm Anti-American. The meaning behind that statement (you obviously didn't catch it and perhaps others didn't either) is that Communist Dictatorships don't allow such rebelious thoughts. Therefore, he'd be dealt with in a way that would silence him. As history shows, that is usually execution. Sure, Eminem might not deserve something as drastic as execution, but censorship is definitely good. Perhaps we should pass a law to uber-censor him. Oh, and since you love to pick on my "Communism is the best form of government ON PAPER" attitude, I'd like to make two comments about that. Number one, it's the truth. On paper, Communism IS the best form of government. Number two, I'm well aware of the fact that if this was a Communist nation, two things would occur. Number one, my family would no longer be rich. Number two, our nation would crumble... So, with that said, get off the "blaze is a Communist, and therefore against America" point of view.

[Virtual Fighter]

[color=#F87500]You didn't pay attention. For instance, you took me talking about the White America song by its title. If you would've paid attention, you would've realized I went into the actual lyrics of the song, as well.
but in there ISNT ANYTHING RACIST IN THE SONG. Nor is it anti american.

Okay, so you didn

[KenDaShoto]

YEAH! WHAT HE SAID!



Edited By KenDaShoto on 1099957322

[Battleaxe22]

this topic has gone on about what Eminem has and hasnt can and cant do has done right and done wrong blaze985 said he isnt smart not by genius standards no but where he fits in hes f***n einstein yea he tlks about his mom did u hear anything vf said? and about white america did u care to stop listenin at the end when he says hes just playin and if anyone has anything else they can point out about how eminem sucks or has done wrong show me ur perfect and ill willing accept everything u say as fact
I'm afraid you are going to have to let the big boys handle

this one, my friend.

-Chris

[KenDaShoto]

Big Boys = VF and Blaze985

[Battleaxe22]

Big Boys = VF and Blaze985
You'll notice my input has been on par with the other two

aforementioned members. Both of these individuals will agree

that they can have an intelligent conversation with me, Ken,

I have yet to see anything relevant posted on your behalf,

however.

Please do have a good day.

-Chris

[KenDaShoto]

twice u have insulted my intelligence and twice i have set myselfup for u to do so

[blaze985]

Please, please, please, VF, try quoting my posts in the correct context. When you simply quote "censorship is good" it makes me seem like an idiot, but in reality, I explained that take in my post. You can't disprove someone when you take what they say out of context...

And, I'll take your religious take on Adam and Eve first. That part about Eve being made from Adam's rib is not to be translated into them being equal. It shows that the women are dependant on the men, and it shows that the men should be the leaders. To be honest, it doesn't matter if you like that or not. This entire conversation is almost pointless, for this is based COMPLETELY on opinion. I don't like Eminem, and you do. Thus, my thoughts of Eminem can't be disproven, and your thoughts of Eminem can't be disproven. Considering opinions aren't fact, you can't disprove them.

What I'm about to say shows my views on the situation of him and his mom, and most of you will disagree considering I'm one of the only true Christians in this community. With that said, here we go... Life is something you owe to God. And, God uses women for child-bearing. Thus, like it or not, you must be thankful for/towards that means in which He uses. In addition, psychiatry tells us that she wouldn't deal with the financial expenses that come along with the addition of a baby. She, more than likely, is only upset at the situation having a baby put her in, and now she looks back and is ashamed of her decision. but, I've been interrupted like... six million times, so I'm going to conclude this post for the time being.

[Virtual Fighter]

[color=#F87500]Please, please, please, VF, try quoting my posts in the correct context. When you simply quote "censorship is good" it makes me seem like an idiot, but in reality, I explained that take in my post. You can't disprove someone when you take what they say out of context...
please, please, please, blaze. I was obviously kidding, since I said

[blaze985]

I wasn't speaking soley of that one quote. You quote all of my sentences chopped up, and that takes them all out of context. You only disprove a single sentence, and that's why you do that. You've yet to disprove an entire argument of mine, and you do that in all of your debates. You can say it's just what Joe does, but that's false. Joe disproves the entire argument, and he doesn't have to take things out of context to do it...

And, no, there is no elitisms. I said nothing of being superior; I only stated truth. To be honest, in all of America (even though America is a 'Christian Country'), very few are truly Christian. Even in the Bible it says that very few will be chosen. In a percentage, it could be estimated 25% of all people in the WORLD are true Christians. Thus, my statement is merely accurate and has nothing to do with being superior.

It's highly doubtful that she truly hated HIM. I think it's obvious based completely on some facts here that you've given me and can be deductively reasoned. Fact: Eminem's mom didn't have very much money. Fact: Baby products are quite expensive. Fact: Babies take up a grand amount of time. Fact: She was unable to do most of the things she truly enjoyed doing. Now then, you can't condone her abuse of him. I'm not doing that, either, so don't go there. but, that is not the argument here. (You also couldn't disprove my argument about being thankful for the means God provides and toward that means, so don't forget that.) Eminem's mom, though not very well-established financially, still kept him and provided for him. In addition, she was content in doing what was necessary and alotting the necessary time to do it. She didn't like doing this, yet she did it anyways. Now then, we know she could have aborted him or put him up for adoption, yet she refused. This can only be explained logically by the fact that she did love him. You ask, why would she beat the one she loves? Well, people get angry at things (in her case, this situation), and they find ways to take it out. She found her way. Though it isn't the right way, it's her way. You speak of Eminem being mentally screwed-up because of his mom, but you forget that she's the same. She has her screws loose. No, that doesn't necessarily condone what she's done (in my opinion, even if someone who is completely insane kills someone, they need punishment), but you can't say that she didn't love him.

People get violent lyrics from many sources, but a quote from the song by Saliva, "Click Click Boom" has something great to say about it. I don't remember it word for word, and I don't have the time to look it up, but the gist was that his parents weren't the best. They screwed up, too, but then he says something like "but you don't hear none of that crying ass bitching from me!" I won't say it's word for word, but that's the gist of it. They seem to have the right view; why can't Eminem do it? Furthermore, Eminem is not the only one with bad lyrics like that. The other people need to change theirs' as well. I thought I'd say that so I'm not accused of just singling Eminem out due to some personal hatred or whatever.

And, that Hitler statement doesn't even fit. That has nothing to do with the situation at all. Eminem's mom didn't kill six million jews. She took anger out on Eminem.

No, the gov't doesn't do everything right, but use examples that are current. Past mistakes mean nothing now. Let's try focusing on the present, shall we? The eugenics 'experiment' wasn't to try to make some race feel stupid. I clearly remember it being done to try to focus on how the government can help its citizens become up-to-par with the rest of the world. If you look at our literacy rate and overall intelligence in comparison to many other countries, we're very low. The government was just trying to help the citizens, and considering there are a high number of minority neighborhoods, ghettos, hoods, and things of that nature that don't involve whites, it seems like a logical take on this negative situation.

And, the example of Manifest Destiny is stupid. NO, I DID NOT SAY YOU ARE STUPID; I SAID YOUR EXAMPLE WAS! There, now that that's cleared away... If you find that bad, then you find imperialism bad, for they are the exact same idea. Thus, that'd make you more anti-world than anti-America, if you ask me... Moreover, my examples I used for that take were merely to show that Eminem HAD to put that line about him not hating America in the song for a reason. He knew the song would come off anti-America because it is. That's bad publicity, so he put that line in there to cover his tracks.

'Tis time for school, but I suppose I can trust I'll be coming home to a few more posts undoubtedly against mine. Bwaha! I love this whole SFO Community vs. blaze thing. It's kind of fun...

[Virtual Fighter]

[color=#F87500]I wasn't speaking soley of that one quote. You quote all of my sentences chopped up, and that takes them all out of context. You only disprove a single sentence, and that's why you do that. You've yet to disprove an entire argument of mine, and you do that in all of your debates. You can say it's just what Joe does, but that's false. Joe disproves the entire argument, and he doesn't have to take things out of context to do it...
I use what I can work with, and what is important. I DON

[blaze985]

Actually, I don't need to take a hint. I have been asked to continue the debate, and that's exactly what I'm doing. Furthermore, Chris has agreed with me on several points. I find it drastically amusing how I can sit here and have a debate and remain civilized in how I do it, yet you sit there and everything you say is either sarcastic, meant to hurt, rude, or something along those lines. This is a debate (I use that term lightly); not a "Let's all get pissed off" rant. I can know for a fact, just as all of you can, that marriages/relationships don't work (for the majority). I believe it's somewhere over half of all relationships/marriages don't work out. At least a third of children around the world get abused daily. Day after day after day, you can watch the news and hear about all the things that children everywhere have to put up with - things that make what Eminem went through child's play, yet they continue to live in high spirits. They don't complain about all the crap they go through or have gone through. And, even if they did, they aren't doing it publicly, selling records of nothing but why he hates his family, society, America, and everything else that may happen to give him a wrong look. The simple fact is, the censorship he fights against is there for a good reason. Kids around the world who get the chance to listen to his music don't think about whatever it is that he went through. They hear him hating on his mom, and they hear him talking about the whores and the sluts and all the times he's had sex. They don't think of what has caused it, and they don't think about what it means. They just hear, "I hate my mom." Or, they hear, "I want to 'f' you." The bottom line is, his lyrics are bad. It doesn't matter what he's gone through, and it doesn't matter how he feels. If he wants to rap, he should do so in a way that doesn't manipulate kids with bad influences. Like it or not, he's a role model, and he needs to act the part. And, then you dare call me out as some bad Christian? You don't even know what Christianity is all about. You don't care, either. Yet, you tell me I'm a bad Christian? It doesn't matter who you are, where you're from, what you're doing, or anything. You do NOT call out someone based on their religious preferences when you know next to NOTHING about them, and then tell them they're a 'bad *insert religion here*.' THAT, VF, is NOT how crap works. I've rephrased and rephrased my comment about MLK Jr. and how my message is that I hate the attention and respect and praise he gets when he's undeserving of it. And, no, I'm not even going to get into that debate again. So, don't EVER say I'm not a good Christian, and don't you EVER comment on my religious beliefs again unless you're trying to learn or something along those lines. Due to your crappy attitude and obvious prejudice against me, including your comment about my religion, I'm exiting myself from this debate before I say something I regret later. Thanks for pissing me off, and I hope you have a simply SPLENDID day.

[Virtual Fighter]

[color=#F87500]yet you sit there and everything you say is either sarcastic, meant to hurt, rude, or something along those lines.

it

[Ludacris]

every album gets leaked lol......... even Em can't be protected from that.........

I'll try to get when I get home..........

[Elena]

VF and Blaze I'm sorry to but in here like this but what the hell does the stuff y'all are talking about have to do with eminem...

Anyways, the ablum sure did leak a guy I know is selling copies....

[Virtual Fighter]

EVERYTHING!

we were debating about his mom, and how i say led to his being fducked in the head, he said that she was a saint.

eminem doesnt like sencorship, nor do i. blaze loves sencorship, and thinks eminem should be censored.

we're takling about eminem being a role model, and about kids listening to him.



did you even read anything we wrote?

[Elena]

Nope sorry I didn't read it I read parts...and it didn't seem like it was about eminem...DO YOU SEE HOW LONG IT IS?! I ain't got time to read it. but i will put in my 2 cents, I believe that no one should be censored. Why because it is how they are feeling? Rappin' is like poetry at times. You don't see ppl censoring it most of the times. but if they do want to restrict it then could just make sure you are eighteen when you buy it or you have to get the edited version...Which probably won't work because ppl would just copy other ppl's cd's or get someone who is 18 to get it.
Do I believe he should be a role model?
He surely ain't no mother Theresa. but he does tell us to stand for what we believe in. And it is not as though he can help that ppl see him as a role model. If ppl get mad at that then they shouldn't be blaming Eminem they should be blaming what ever got the person feeling that way.

[Virtual Fighter]

Nope sorry I didn't read it I read parts...and it didn't seem like it was about eminem...DO YOU SEE HOW LONG IT IS?! I ain't got time to read it.

hehe. yeah, it's this thing i do when what ever anyone says, i have to makea rebbuttle two times longer.

Do I believe he should be a role model?
He surely ain't no mother Theresa. but he does tell us to stand for what we believe in.

true.

also, i dont think people should be blaming eminem for when 6 year olds dress all gangsta and call eminem their role model.

blame the PARENTS.

because if you let your kids dress gangsta, listen to eminem and even model their lives after eminem, it's not eminems fault, it's the parents fault for letting it happen.

its like when fat people blame mchdonalds for making them fat.

[QUIET_KILLER]

A fierce battle between those two I would post something longar a ferocious but go to watch smallville itz on and it is good man is this battle between vf and blaze almost ova ?
Are they going to take it a few skittlez and m&Mz up a notch ???

[blaze985]

I've already said I exit this debate. I won't be apart of anything or anyone who disses me from a religious stand point. I do not and will not tolerate it. Furthermore, I never said his mom was a saint. I merely said she isn't as bad as Eminem makes her out to be, and that Eminem has no right to do what he does to her... It's obvious here that this community is democratic, and that is the very reason my ideas are shunned here. What's so hilarious, is that it doesn't matter how logical, supported, or obviously true my information is, it will never be able to change anyone here's mind, for y'all are democrats, and I'm a republican. I see very few other republicans here. So, please refrain from dragging me into this debate any further.

And, just so I don't have to make yet another topic that wastes bandwidth, I'd just like to say I'm leaving. I don't find a point in being here as I seldom actually play SFO and no one here shares my believes and therefore, I am fighting a losing battle. I'm rather sick of being on the business end of everyone's "You're wrong, and I'm right" simply because I'm a Christian Republican. but, this thread is not for good-byes. I just didn't feel like making another thread. Good-bye, and thanks to those of you who actually accepted my thoughts. Have fun, and enjoy yourselves.

[Virtual Fighter]

http://upl.silentwhisper.net/uplfolders/upload4/nomoretears.jpg

no need to cry about it, blaze.

[QUIET_KILLER]

aww come on vf your both intelligient. :alien:
you both can be the bigga man. :biggrin:
You fought wit wordz what has to be next ego pride and anger slurz and random pissing pot contestz?
I hope this truly is not a tex@$ v$ $anfran$ico thing itz pointlesz.
Your both great statez why the skateboarder vs the cowboy ok corral shoot out ???
Your both respectable memberz and vipz yall set an example fo lil kidz oh d forum right or wrong?
What legacy do you want to leave behind should you disappear of the earth?

[HELLOTHERE]

Well, it doesn't even matter about eminem's mom nowbecause he barely raps about her anymore, so....



Edited By HELLOTHERE on 1100177415

[MasterX05]

Who the fluck is Blaze? Are u Nantanko Joes lil brother?

lol blaze said rock and rap are diffrent and are a totaly diffrent lvl. I like the song "Lets go" How rapper Trick daddy took a sample from ozzy osbornes song. Yes even that guitar sole is sick. Jay-z 99 problems, do I even have to say the great mans name behind that song? "Rick Rubin". And who cant forget DMC/walk this way.

As for the E boy, my nig ronney already got it on bootleg with the bonus and shiznt so im cop that form him.

[Virtual Fighter]

the grey album is proof rock and rap are NOT that different.

DJ danger mouse mixed the beatles' white album, some say it is the best rock album every conceived, with jay-z's the black album, which some say (i do too) is the greatest rap album ever.

he added the beats from the beatles and the vocals of jayz, and what you get is the grey album. (get it, black album + white album = grey album?)

the beats were seamless, and it worked so well.

we shouldn't segregate the two artforms, we should combine them and create a new generation of amazing music.

[Zpower]

Heres a quote from me yay... "Music will always be diverse, as long as people are different. Since (Ax + Bx = C then B - C x = A) .... think about it..."



Edited By Zpower on 1100211030

[Virtual Fighter]

^^ your equation makes no sence... i tried it and i got 3 - 20 = 4 :(

i think you're reffering to A + B = C then B - C = A.

it's called the subtraction property of equality, and i'm still not sure how that applies to music being different.

[Zpower]

your equation makes no sence...
exactly.. :hehe:

Who the fluck is Blaze? Are u Nantanko Joes lil brother?
Hahahahaha.....right on the button. By the way...

DAMMIT BLAZE! I TOLD YOU TO STAY OFF MY COMPUTER! IF YOU'RE SO PRO-WINDOWS, KEEP OFF MY UBER MAC!!

As for the entire rap/rock thing....

I havn't read the topic, nor do I intend to. but it was brought to my attention that a large contingent of people have said, in this thread, that rock and rap music are similar and alike, with very few differences...and their "proof" was the large amount of rappers who will take a cut from a rock song and add in some snare and extra drums and whatnot and turn it into a beat for a rap song.

Now hear me clearly. This does not make rock and rap similar. It just means that those rappers who have to use rock songs for their own beats apparently can't come up with good beats of their own.

Rock and rap are two opposites....they're north and south, top and bottom, hot and cold, Oprah and Weight Watchers, George bush and a brain, John Kerry and charisma......catch my drift? The two have very little....if anything....in common. Let me educate you kids a little:

Rock music is performed with multiple members in their group or band, and each member has a different role in the band. Each member plays a different instrument (guitar, bass guitar, drums, etc), and there is a frontman, who is the vocalist--he or she can either do nothing but vocalize, or vocalize AND play an instrument--usually guitar--at the same time. Rock music, for the most part, is predominently comprised of guitar and bass guitar music, including a heavy emphasis on the drums. The music itself is constantly changing...it's a song that's constantly flowing and changing (for the most part, that is). Songs usually have a period without vocalization, which is used solely for instrumentals, possibly guitar riffs or drum solos. Rock is performed mostly by members of the caucasian race (with exceptions, of course), and breaks down into various categories including alternative, punk/ska, and metal. Song lyrics and references vary drastically, and sometimes or usually require a firm intellectual understanding to grasp their true meanings.

Rap is usually performed by a single person....sometimes with one or two others. With only VERY FEW exceptions, there is no true instrumentation involved...no guitar, drums, or other instruments. The background music is usually created electronically, using computers, sound recorders, synthesizers, etc. The background music "beats" are comprised primarily of drum beats (usually and primarily the bass drum) with other "digitally mixed" music mixed in, and is mostly repetitive in nature, occuring in sequences of three or four beats, then repeat. If there is a single rapper, he or she generally vocalizes in sync with the beat throughout the song...if there are multiple rappers, turns are usually taken. Rap is mostly performed by african-americans (with exceptions, of course), and breaks down into a couple categories (gangsta rap is the only one that comes to mind, i can't think of the official name of any other categories). Most of the lyrics pertain to urban life or life in the inner city or ghettos and hip-hop culture.

Now please tell me how rock and rap are one and the same



Edited By Shauku on 1100294625

[Battleaxe22]

The avatar says it all folks.

-Chris

[blanka09]

*cracks nuckles*

Okay... first off welcome Nantuko joe... I see your green texts haven't lost their valour :biggrin:

In any sense, you'll know the only reason I'm posting here and now is cause I in fact do not agree with ur concepts about rap and rock being totally different in their production.

Of course, there're both 2 different genre of music.. but that does not mean they have nothing in common. If my memory serves well, one piece in fact CAME from the other one. I won't jump into any conclusions as to which came first, but I'll give you the scoop when time and brain power permits.

You said and I quote...

Songs usually have a period without vocalization, which is used solely for instrumentals, possibly guitar riffs or drum solos.

i.e... an adlib so to say... Now go listen almost all recent rap songs that feature an R&B duo... or just plain rap songs... hmm, lemme think of a good one.. ah better yet, an old one... Thug mentality by Krayzie bone. It has a spot where you hear nothing but the "beats" as you all call it. Whether it's at the beginning of the song, at the middle part (just before the R&B singers take over).. or at the tale end.. there's always (for the most part) an adlib to a rap song where the talents of the producer is being "showcased".

Song lyrics and references vary drastically, and sometimes or usually require a firm intellectual understanding to grasp their true meanings.


You know that's not 100% correct. Both genres have their share of idiotic lyrics that just spawn from the shallowest portion of the minds of these individuals. Sometimes, rappers say/rap about nothing more than what they have and what they can do to you... as for rockers, Well, I don't really want to go through the trouble of looking for "senseless" lyrics to some rock songs out there.

Of course, most of them are meaningful, and as for rap as well, you'll have a lot of meaningful lyrics to some of the songs. There's a few of them... but I won't bore you by listing them.

In any case, the point I'm trying to bring is that you'll always find some of the elements from one genre in the other and vice versa. Something about rap would be in rock.. and something about rock would be in rap. That's why the joint venture by Aerosmith and Run DMC was a success.

You could basically mix up both worlds and come up with something lovely. Check out Linkin Park's In the end. I still find myself struggling to categorize that song as to whether it's a rap song or a rock song. Why?? Just like you say.. it has repeatitive beats... care to argue?? I'm listening to it right now :biggrin:

And then you have this show on MTV (can't quite get the name) that feature Snoop Dogg freestyling to the instrumentals by a rock group.

So no matter how you look at it, there'll always be similarities :biggrin:

[Virtual Fighter]

[color=#F87500]DAMMIT BLAZE! I TOLD YOU TO STAY OFF MY COMPUTER! IF YOU'RE SO PRO-WINDOWS, KEEP OFF MY UBER MAC!!


oh god... don

[blanka09]

[quote:post_uid0="Virtual Fighter"][color=#000000]They

[HELLOTHERE]

Group Who made songs together:

Snoop Dogg & Korn
Jay-Z & Linkin Park(And the song, " In the End" is just about rap throught the whole thing except for the chorus)
Trick Daddy using part of Ozzy's song
And Lil' John & Blink 182
Xzbit & Blink 182

NOW I DARE SOMEONE TO TELL ME THAT RAP AND ROCK ARN'T EVEN CLOSE TO SIMILAR! :angry:



Edited By HELLOTHERE on 1100307987

[blanka09]

hehe.. yeah yeah.. let's rally behind VF and shout at Joe XD

[Virtual Fighter]

cuz joe is a poopoo head.

[color=green]Hello again blanka, long time no debate. Hopefully DM will get off his drunken butt and get BG back up so I can get back to debating full-time.

By the way, I hope you picked this up...my post wasn't intended to be a "genre is better than genre" post, as that's how such things are interpreted. Rather, I figured that a simple compare and contrast was in order.

Blanka09....
i.e... an adlib so to say... Now go listen almost all recent rap songs that feature an R&B duo... or just plain rap songs... hmm, lemme think of a good one.. ah better yet, an old one... Thug mentality by Krayzie bone. It has a spot where you hear nothing but the "beats" as you all call it. Whether it's at the beginning of the song, at the middle part (just before the R&B singers take over).. or at the tale end.. there's always (for the most part) an adlib to a rap song where the talents of the producer is being "showcased".

I included that in the rock section because I knew that it existed for rock....because I don't listen to rap, I was unaware of the presence of the "solo" in rap music. Generally, the only rap I ever hear is maybe once every couple weeks or so, when a coworker of mine will bring in a Gheto Boys / GangStarr CD to listen to, at which point I don't really pay much attention, to be honest. So yeah, I do suppose it should be included just for the sake of the comparsion part of my C&C post.

You know that's not 100% correct. Both genres have their share of idiotic lyrics that just spawn from the shallowest portion of the minds of these individuals. Sometimes, rappers say/rap about nothing more than what they have and what they can do to you... as for rockers, Well, I don't really want to go through the trouble of looking for "senseless" lyrics to some rock songs out there.
Of course, most of them are meaningful, and as for rap as well, you'll have a lot of meaningful lyrics to some of the songs. There's a few of them... but I won't bore you by listing them.

Hehe, my intended subtle generalization apparently wasn't so subtle after all.

To tell you the truth, it took me a while to write that post from a non-biased standpoint, as I have a hard time separating good rap from the "cash/money/booze/drugs/girls/ghetto/i own you" lyrics, especially since I'm not a fan of the genre. Granted, I know that both genres have their PLENTIFUL respective shares of artists with lyrics that seem like they were shat out a dog's arse, but I was referring to the ones that actually MEAN something.

Once again trying to not sound biased, I've heard a LOT of rock songs that, although I can memorize the lyrics, I can't interpret them well (same with poetry, can't do that either). There are lots of songs that require some higher thought to try and decipher the meaning to, so I've found. This is NOT to say that rap music doesn't have this, it's just that I havn't been exposed to it, and therefore don't know very much about it.

In any case, the point I'm trying to bring is that you'll always find some of the elements from one genre in the other and vice versa. Something about rap would be in rock.. and something about rock would be in rap. That's why the joint venture by Aerosmith and Run DMC was a success.

....probably the only collaboration that actually turned out well, that I've heard at least. What do we have nowadays? Fred Durst and Method Man, or Tommy Lee trying to make a rap, or something along those lines. Recent attempts to mix the two have pretty much gone down the dumps

You could basically mix up both worlds and come up with something lovely. Check out Linkin Park's In the end. I still find myself struggling to categorize that song as to whether it's a rap song or a rock song. Why?? Just like you say.. it has repeatitive beats... care to argue?? I'm listening to it right now

With what I said above standing, Linkin Park is no exception. In-house, they've made a successful mix between rock and rap tunes. "In the End," for example, seems to switch between the two, with repetitive beats and piano keys going on during Shinoda's rap-style vocal session, then switching over to more heavy drums and guitar for Chester's singing session. Same goes for many of their other songs, including "Place for My Head," and one of my favorites "Easier to Run." Hell, during some songs ("Numb" comes to mind), they manage to pull off having a rap-style beat going with Chester actually SINGING to it instead of rapping....quite a feat. This, however, is all in-house work.

However, when they actually TRIED to go for various rap/rock collaboration remixes on their "Reanimation" album, they turned out rather....poorly. Yes, it was interesting to listen to the changeups they made, but in the end (no pun intended), it wasn't a good collaborative effort.

Don't get me wrong though, I'm a big LP fan. Just didn't like their efforts in Reanimation.

--

Something I should have clarified on, however, was that the exception is that not ALL rock songs are devoid of the repetitive beats. Tracks that come to mind (at 2:52am EST, so don't get disappointed at my lack of examples) are "I'll Be Watching You" by Sting, "Kashmir" by Led Zeppelin (as well as "When the Levee Breaks," which has quite possibly one of the most ripped-off drum tracks in music history), "Dream On" by Aerosmith, and some track from Ozzy that I heard some rapper took, can't remember which.

Note the latter point though, that they're all tracks that were taken by rappers, remixed, and used for background music--Puff Daddy using "I'll Be Watching You" and "Kashmir," making the songs "I'll Be Missing You," and "Come With Me," respectively; "Dream On" which was used by Eminem. Snoop Dogg once tried to rap to a version of Metallica's "Sad but True," and Kid Rock pretty much took the hard copy full-version background music to the same song for his "American Badass." Hence the exceptions to the rule, which apparently are oft-reaped for their usability in the rap industry.

And then you have this show on MTV (can't quite get the name) that feature Snoop Dogg freestyling to the instrumentals by a rock group.

Never heard of it.

--------------------

[quote]Virtual Fighter....
oh god... don

[Saijin_Ryu]

Rap and Rock are totally Different :

http://www.johnlewis.com/jl_assets/product/230172216.jpg

See?

[Virtual Fighter]

[color=#F87500]Wow, that's an overgeneralization if I've ever seen one. Saying that both rock and rap are "rebellious" music forms? How so? The only rebellious type of rock music there is was the old school punk rock, which was basically antiauthority music. As for rap, well yeah, with all the songs about drugs and "flip the Police" and whatnot, I can see that, but not all of it is "rebellious" music.

no, they did. Are you telling me that the world was in open arms to elvis and his pelvic thrusts?

Rock and roll was NOT accepted, it was a rebbelion. Parents thought it was devil music, and rockers still didn

[KenDaShoto]

This topic is filled with poop and someone needs to clean it up

[HELLOTHERE]

--KoRn also has done tracks with Ice Cube, Nate Dogg and Nas, and poorly covered "Word Up." KoRn is also (for some strange reason) SOMETIMES categorized as rock/rap, like L.Bizket.
--"In the End" is basically evenly rock/rap, not just about rap throughout. Linkin Park is also predominently a rock/rap band.
--Trick Daddy using Ozzy's song doesn't mean that the two groups collaborated, it just means that Trick Daddy used his music (much like the examples I provided above)
--Blink 182 isn't even really rock, they're like...oober mainstream punk-wannabes.

Note also, that ALL of the above listed collaborations, including the ones I listed (sans "I'll Be Watching You") sucked.


Your just picking out the little details of it. You just need to see the overall picture.

[KenDaShoto]

anybody heard PUKE that song is raw

[Vash]

I seen on a site the songs it has on it and its good it has his hit so Just loose it on there and thats my favorite song.

--KoRn also has done tracks with Ice Cube, Nate Dogg and Nas, and poorly covered "Word Up." KoRn is also (for some strange reason) SOMETIMES categorized as rock/rap, like L.Bizket.
--"In the End" is basically evenly rock/rap, not just about rap throughout. Linkin Park is also predominently a rock/rap band.
--Trick Daddy using Ozzy's song doesn't mean that the two groups collaborated, it just means that Trick Daddy used his music (much like the examples I provided above)
--Blink 182 isn't even really rock, they're like...oober mainstream punk-wannabes.

Note also, that ALL of the above listed collaborations, including the ones I listed (sans "I'll Be Watching You") sucked.


Your just picking out the little details of it. You just need to see the overall picture.
Ermm...I WAS looking at the overall picture, which was paraphrased when I said "Note also, that ALL of the above listed collaborations, including the ones I listed (sans "I'll Be Missing You" sucked."

The Linkin Park cut that you mentioned is exempt though, since it wasn't an outside collaboration. Now had you said Linkin Park's "H! VLTG3," or just about any other song on Reanimation, then it would be included in what I said, because they all included vocal tracks from rappers in an attempt to make a good collaboration, and they all sucked.

[QUIET_KILLER]

Hmm..this topic has been deemed morphable :biggrin:
It went from m&mz to skittlez to snickerz to twix to rock to then ???
To a now linkinbarragecanodagepark? :ghostface: This is most (phearsome)

[mastergrim8]

yall shoulda herd it

yall shoulda herd it
http://home.graffiti.net/joeballs/threadnecro.jpg

[Saijin_Ryu]

HaHa, Magic the Gathering.

[Battleaxe22]

I thought they deleted this thread. Well there is no point for it anymore.